Z3 questions from potential new owner

[sstodvictory]

I'll be buying either a used s2000 or a used Z3 2.5i with Premium package before the end of tomorrow. Never owned a sport car before. I think I'd enjoy either one, but they're very different. I will drive a lot on township level roads in hilly areas, roads that are not engineered much and can be bumpy or broken in places.

Would anyone share their thoughts about the Z3 with respect to..........?

Suspension especially rear:
Something touched and scraped on a rough right turn under hard acceleration on my first test ride. I'm thinking it might have been the tire touching the wheel well liner. I'll get a chance to drive it more tomorrow, but it has me wondering if the rear suspension is too soft. Is it considered desireable to stiffen the rear suspension and are there aftermarket parts for that? Can anything on this car touch down against the road when you're aggresive on the less engineered surfaces?

Bombing around on gravel roads:
I love doing this. How's it handle on gravel? Is it better if you turn the automatic wheel control stuff off?

What is "bump-steer"?

Shifter:
It felt notchy between two of the gears on downshifting, but can't remember which gears now, maybe 3rd and 2nd, anyway I had to hunt for the gear. Is that normal and if so does it get smoother once you learn the shifter?

Plastic rear window:
Is there anything available in the aftermarket in the way of stick-on defogger wires? If not have any of you done it the do-it-yourself way? I"m thinking there must be a place to plug some wires in, since my understanding is that a hard top with defogger is available.

Thanks!

Steve

 

[Big Daddy]

Welcome Steve. I have owned a 97 2.8 and now have a 98 3.2 M roadster. I have never had my suspension on either bottom out. The 2.8 was stock, the M has Dinan suspension. I love the Dinan and it handles exceptional. I can scrape the front bumper on curbs or driveways and that will always be something to watch for. If you bottomed out the 2.5 I'd say something is soft and needs upgrading.

The Z'3 are prone to rock chips and to gravel at the front of the rear fenders. I do NOT drive mine in gravel however I believe it would handle well there too.

Bump Steer

My sifter in both cars was solid and felt crisp. The M has a Dinan short shifter.

Do not know about rear window defogger wires, I would think it would cause your plastic window to dry out and crack. I have a hardtop for my roadster and it has a defogger built in.

I have driven the S2000 and prefer the BMW. The S2000 needs to be wound up to feel the power/torque and that is not easily done during city driving. I like the torque of the M and it delivers at all RPM's.

Good luck and keep us posted.

 

[Kirby]

A word of caution regarding that scraping noise. A uncommon, but not unheard of problem, is that the chassis mounting points for the rear subframe can crack and bend. It seems that it happens mostly on Z3s that have been tracked or driven hard, BUT even then it does not always occur.

If I were buying a Z3, I would have it inspected for that problem before I bought it. Actually, most BMW dealers will do a "pre-sale" inspection for private sales. They charge about $100 and do a pretty thorough check of the car, you can point this out to them and specifically ask them to check it.

If the seller is honest, they will have no concerns about you doing this inspection. I did this when I bought my 325i, got a clean bill of health and I slept a lot better that night!

If you search the forums here ( http://www.hotbimmer.net/forum/showthread.php?t=7745&highlight=subframe ), or google, Z3 Subframe, you'll get a lot of info. Don't let it scare you away though. They are great cars!

 

[sstodvictory]

Here's how it turned out.

The dealer put a "move it now" price on the S2000. After experiencing that "scream-like-a-banshee" top end on my local play-roads and discovering that I can manage it, I couldn't resist. 15,565 miles on it, mint condition, nice color, one owner, complete service history, $22,998. A lady had bought it new from the local dealer and then traded it for a Jeep because it wasn't good in snow.

There could be a BMW Z in my future yet, because I think I've caught the sports car bug.

Thanks for your help Kirby and Big Daddy! [driving2]

Steve

 

[Kirby]

Congrats! The S2000 is a nice roadster, just somewhat different from a bimmer. The S2000 is a great AutoCross car. Go find your local SCCA chapter and give it a try!

 

[Zee3Coupe]

Too late for your purposes Steve, but regarding the notchie shift, I have two thoughts that might be helpful to others. The first is that I've heard pins in the shift forks (or something to that effect) can wearing and make for slightly notchy shifting. This is most noticable trying to engage into first from a stop or any other gear, and can at times make you resort to double clutching to help match things up. These can and should be replaced, and since I've begun notcing these symptoms in my own coupe, I'll look into this further and let you all know Iperhaps in a different thread) what I find out.

The second cause of 'notchy shifting' can be flex in the chassis around hard corners. I noticed this much more in while driving a roadster in hard corners than my coupe, but as I probed the limits of my own cars began to notice it more and more. Once I put in an HMS stress/strut bar, this was almost completely eliminated. I highly recommend this minor and relatively inexpensive mod.

Finally, the design of the rear suspension, I'm sure you've all noticed, is unforgiving. It can cut lose quickly and with only a little warning if you get on the gas too soon coming out of a corner, especially low speed ones. And I LOVE IT!

 

[sstodvictory]

Thanks again. Bought a few books about sports car and competition driving technique and I'm starting to read up. Had never thought about autocross but one of them covers that pretty thoroughly.

From the description of bump steer at that link, I gather that small directional changes or a feeling of shifting back and forth at high speed on a bumpy surface can happen in a straight section? At least that's how I read it, am I wrong? I posted a question about bump steer at a S2000 forum and all the responses put it in a cornering context and seemed to attribute it to the rear suspension only, but that seems like too narrow an interpretation. I can imagine how a wheel that goes out-of-perpendicular with the road surface during shock compression, could produce steering physics similar to a motorcycle tire if it means the car's weight shifts to the shoulder of the tire.

Steve

 

[Zee3Coupe]

Your bump steer description sounds a lot like 'tramlining', though I'm not sure if they're one in the same. Tramlining, as you described, occurs when one of the tires catches a groove in the pavement and the car feels like it tries to take off on you. Perhaps someone else can provide a better description of the cause, but its certainly more evident with wider wheels/tires. Its pretty evident in the Z3, though the installation of a stress bar, again, goes a long way toward taking care of it.

 

[MrElussive]

Congrats on the car. You got any pictures of it? If so, do post them up. I was going to say the S2000 is a better performance vehicle than the Z3 2.5i, but the Z3 would have been easier to live with on a daily basis. I would have gone with the S2000 as well.

 

[sstodvictory]

Congrats on the car. You got any pictures of it? If so, do post them up. I was going to say the S2000 is a better performance vehicle than the Z3 2.5i, but the Z3 would have been easier to live with on a daily basis. I would have gone with the S2000 as well.

Sure thing! I've put two pics in the "General Car Chat" forum here:

http://www.bmwboard.com/forum/showthread.php?p=152816#post152816

My purchase kindled the interest of a coworker and now he's looking at the same Z3 I was test driving.

Steve
.

 

[Dash Singh]

1st time from South Africa

I'll be buying either a used s2000 or a used Z3 2.5i with Premium package before the end of tomorrow. Never owned a sport car before. I think I'd enjoy either one, but they're very different. I will drive a lot on township level roads in hilly areas, roads that are not engineered much and can be bumpy or broken in places.

Would anyone share their thoughts about the Z3 with respect to..........?

Suspension especially rear:
Something touched and scraped on a rough right turn under hard acceleration on my first test ride. I'm thinking it might have been the tire touching the wheel well liner. I'll get a chance to drive it more tomorrow, but it has me wondering if the rear suspension is too soft. Is it considered desireable to stiffen the rear suspension and are there aftermarket parts for that? Can anything on this car touch down against the road when you're aggresive on the less engineered surfaces?

Bombing around on gravel roads:
I love doing this. How's it handle on gravel? Is it better if you turn the automatic wheel control stuff off?

What is "bump-steer"?

Shifter:
It felt notchy between two of the gears on downshifting, but can't remember which gears now, maybe 3rd and 2nd, anyway I had to hunt for the gear. Is that normal and if so does it get smoother once you learn the shifter?

Plastic rear window:
Is there anything available in the aftermarket in the way of stick-on defogger wires? If not have any of you done it the do-it-yourself way? I"m thinking there must be a place to plug some wires in, since my understanding is that a hard top with defogger is available.

Thanks!

Steve

Hi
I am from South Africa & I have a 1998 BMW Z3. They were released in our country with a 2.8 engine. Have not had a problem with scraping the floor. Did experience the gear change becomming "notchy" but it was due to my clutch wearing out. Don't have a major problem with fog in my part of the world. Hope u enjoy your new wheels.
It's my 1st time on this site, so if you guys can teach me how to put a pic of my car online, then I will.
Cheers
Dash

 

[Big Daddy]

Our 97's had the 2.8. We got the 1.9 is 96, 2.8 in 97 and the 3.2 M in 98.

 

[Dash Singh]

Still learning how to navigate ouround this site. Any hints will be most welcome. By the way, I saw my first 2005 M5 today at the local BMW dealer. They were getting it ready for delivery to the new owner. Huge V10 engine with 19inch wheels. Apparently it does 0-100km in less than 5 seconds. In South Africa it costs about 850 000 Rands (about 142000 USD). Our car prices are very high compared with the US & Europe.
Any hints on how to stop a few drops of water getting in during rainy days?
Cheers
Dash

 

[Big Daddy]

Where is the top leaking? Get a good rubber seal conditioner, I use Zymol and the seals on my roadster do not leak!