You thought wrong...

[lifewithbmw]

QuickCivicGuy you got some problems. Go to a HONDA forum and don't bother in a BMW one like most of you here. I know what can BMW do and what can a HONDA do.

Because you have a F**** civic all striped down interior doesn't mean you are fast.

You can't even compare Honda with BMW.

I have a 1994 325i with Dinan Chip and I know what can my car do. I have been racing a Rally for few years and there are no cars like BMW's. My 325i has stock wheels which are 205/60/15 and I can take a double apex turn at 130mph. I did drive the same turn in a Honda Accord and the car was going to flew at 90mph.

You should stop looking for that M coupe and finally get ONE!!! Because that is one of the best balanced BMW's out there and than you'll see where is HONDA.

I don't mean to argue but c'mon lets be mature and think about that. BMW HONDA

 

[lifewithbmw]

Oh and AndrewBall I know 325is 87 well and I know they are lighter than E36's but 10 something second's quarter mile is very low. I don't give a F*** about quarter mile because thats not a point of a racing. We in Europe call racing a different kind of Racing.

But believe me thats to low. You are getting probably like low 13's. But the story was great.

 

[AndrewBall]

exactly my point from the begining, this isnt about Civictools drag racing fetish its about how well the BMWs perform in racing without 500hp and 30-50psi of boost and crap like that BMW's have excelled for years in all sorts of racing with less power than the compitition and still win. infact a 200hp BMW is very quick, I have yet to see a very quick 200hp Honda.

 

[brahtw8]

I usually weigh in on these threads, so here's my $0.02:

Hondas have racing pedigree, and are competitive in SCCA and many other forms of racing without forced induction.

Don't misunderstand, I root for Bill Auberlen and the BMWs when I watch Speed Channel, but the ricer phenomenon of neon glow tubes and double-sushi bar wings has little if nothing to do with Honda racing. Honda is an innovative company with significant engineering prowess. I could drive a lot of marques, but I choose BMW and Honda, and have for many years.

Right now I am debating my replacement for the 325i, which will be for sale in the relatively recent future. I may well buy a new Acura TSX or TL, since both offer comfort, decent performance, and a 6spd, plus they have a warranty. Otherwise, its a 99 540i, 99 M3, or 2001 330xi. I would hate to be Bimmerless (if only for a few months), but if I bought or leased the Acura, I may be able to get a 3rd car and buy the old M car I really want but can't drive every day or in winter. (E28 or E34 M5 or E36 M3) For my parents, ie people who want reliable automatic transmission front-drivers, I have recommended Acuras for years.

As for the pissing contest, I could care less.

 

[AndrewBall]

exactly...but if i were to get rid of my 3 id prolly get a Datsun 5-10, partly cause my dad had an old SCCA GT-4 5-10 so we have all kinds of parts/goodies for it and they look cool from every angle but the front. also like an old mini turn it into a rally car/street car, some rally suspension, rub a little power out of it, and go have a blast in it, and the fact that being a school student i could park it anywhere.

 

[///M SPEED]

I usually weigh in on these threads, so here's my $0.02:

Hondas have racing pedigree, and are competitive in SCCA and many other forms of racing without forced induction.

Don't misunderstand, I root for Bill Auberlen and the BMWs when I watch Speed Channel, but the ricer phenomenon of neon glow tubes and double-sushi bar wings has little if nothing to do with Honda racing. Honda is an innovative company with significant engineering prowess. I could drive a lot of marques, but I choose BMW and Honda, and have for many years.

Right now I am debating my replacement for the 325i, which will be for sale in the relatively recent future. I may well buy a new Acura TSX or TL, since both offer comfort, decent performance, and a 6spd, plus they have a warranty. Otherwise, its a 99 540i, 99 M3, or 2001 330xi. I would hate to be Bimmerless (if only for a few months), but if I bought or leased the Acura, I may be able to get a 3rd car and buy the old M car I really want but can't drive every day or in winter. (E28 or E34 M5 or E36 M3) For my parents, ie people who want reliable automatic transmission front-drivers, I have recommended Acuras for years.

As for the pissing contest, I could care less.

AMEN! Honda has a long line of racing pedigree. You guys need to lay off the "Honda is shit stance" and "because it is BMW it has to be so much better" attitude. Both companies make very nice cars. I own both and love them for different reasons.

Straight line or curves! Racing is racing! Just because you don't like one form of racing does not mean another form is crap. You could argue this point forever and both would never be wrong or right. It takes skill to be good in all forms of racing.

 

[mikev]

exactly my point from the begining, this isnt about Civictools drag racing fetish its about how well the BMWs perform in racing without 500hp and 30-50psi of boost and crap like that BMW's have excelled for years in all sorts of racing with less power than the compitition and still win. infact a 200hp BMW is very quick, I have yet to see a very quick 200hp Honda.

Honda S2000 240Ps 0-100Kph (0-62Mph) 6.2 v BMW Z4 3.0i 225Bhp (the Z4 costs £5000 more)
Honda Accord Type R 209Ps 0-60Mph 7.1secs
Honda Civic Type R 200ps 6.8secs

these are new cars with all the toys 7.1secs is a quick time for the 4 door family saloon these are quick cars and stomp all over similarly powered BMWs (let alone bang for buck!)

 

[brahtw8]

Honda S2000 240Ps 0-100Kph (0-62Mph) 6.2 v BMW Z4 3.0i 225Bhp (the Z4 costs £5000 more)
Honda Accord Type R 209Ps 0-60Mph 7.1secs
Honda Civic Type R 200ps 6.8secs

these are new cars with all the toys 7.1secs is a quick time for the 4 door family saloon these are quick cars and stomp all over similarly powered BMWs (let alone bang for buck!)

No Accord R or Civic R in the US, exactly, but of course you are not in the US since you know your boot from your bonnet and may have scratched a wing or two. In the US, a saloon is a 19th century western watering hole.

However, the Acura TSX is essentially an Accord R from what I understand, and the Civic Type R sounds similar in spec to the Acura RSX.

 

[AndrewBall]

The E46, E65(whatever they are now) are HEAVY LUXURY & SLOW, i like how you didnt post the z4's times and compared the hondas to the stragler of the bunch. Never said Honda is shit, but ive never seen a Honda out perform a BMW in a fair Battle dont even talk About Speed World Challenge 2dr Sports car vs 4dr heavy underpowered cars. go to a group where the BMW isnt limited and watch who walks away on a straight or accelerates out of teh corners fast, in the 8years ive been going to races IVE NEVER, NEVER! seen a Japanese Car of the same run group, same rules and regulations for every car, regardless make. and never seen a BMW get beaten like they do in speed world challenge, its ridiculous. A BMW M3 is built to compete with Factory Porsche's whats an S2000 Made to compete with? Other S2000's, how about the NSX? other NSX's maybe a rare few are an exception. most the japanese sports cars are designed to be competitive in Japanese Touring Car. So something like a Factory Porsche which is the the pedigree of the sports car, is designed for the 24hours of Lemans and who has won it more than porsche? besides...porsche, who did porsche fend off in these battles, BMW. Where is BMW now? Formula One, strong Formula One Team at that where is Honda in F1? Backmarkers.

 

[ODDferkOUT]

No Accord R or Civic R in the US, exactly, but of course you are not in the US since you know your boot from your bonnet and may have scratched a wing or two. In the US, a saloon is a 19th century western watering hole.

However, the Acura TSX is essentially an Accord R from what I understand, and the Civic Type R sounds similar in spec to the Acura RSX.

TSX is just the top euro-spec Accord if I've read correctly, they haven't released an R version yet.

 

[mikev]

The E46, E65(whatever they are now) are HEAVY LUXURY & SLOW, i like how you didnt post the z4's times and compared the hondas to the stragler of the bunch. Never said Honda is shit, but ive never seen a Honda out perform a BMW in a fair Battle dont even talk About Speed World Challenge 2dr Sports car vs 4dr heavy underpowered cars. go to a group where the BMW isnt limited and watch who walks away on a straight or accelerates out of teh corners fast, in the 8years ive been going to races IVE NEVER, NEVER! seen a Japanese Car of the same run group, same rules and regulations for every car, regardless make. and never seen a BMW get beaten like they do in speed world challenge, its ridiculous. A BMW M3 is built to compete with Factory Porsche's whats an S2000 Made to compete with? Other S2000's, how about the NSX? other NSX's maybe a rare few are an exception. most the japanese sports cars are designed to be competitive in Japanese Touring Car. So something like a Factory Porsche which is the the pedigree of the sports car, is designed for the 24hours of Lemans and who has won it more than porsche? besides...porsche, who did porsche fend off in these battles, BMW. Where is BMW now? Formula One, strong Formula One Team at that where is Honda in F1? Backmarkers.

Fair points i get confused about what models you have. EG accura is a model rather than brand of car over here the NSX supercar is just the HONDA NSX the accura is a 4 door saloon for us. Oh and andrew the S2000 competes in EXACTLY the same class as the Z4 the 2 seat roadster and does the job better. (even the roof goes down quicker on the S2000) i also don't see how the 3.0l Z4 is the straggler of the bunch being BMWs flagship production roadster now do you?? times on both cars are pretty much the same. oh and your kidding yourself if you think the M3 is built to race against factory porsches. its built to make BMW money. thats the only reason. the M3 is too heavy and underpowered compared to the porsche and a 911 turbo will destroy an M3. Oh and about racing on this speedworld challange. The real reason you've never seen a BMW loose to a JAP car is obviously because a. you havn't watched it enough b. there arn't many jap cars there c. the drivers suck. ask steve soper wether he thinks Honda could beat BMW or not!!! thats real racing BTCC DTM the lot.

 

[donmbmw]

Hey, this was a great thread! Very entertaining. Lets not smoke the kid too bad, he wrote a very entertaining post. And anyway, since when should truth get in the way of a good story?

 

[bahnstormer]

i don't think running 13" wheels on a serios track is a good idea, don't u want to have at least 12" rotors, with some solid piston calipers?

 

[318intelligance]

my opinion, is that the only good honda would be the NSX cuz its rear wheel drive. FWD is just not as fun(I have a modified 2.4L Neon, and i prefer my 1.8L 318i).

I think Nissan is much better than honda. Why don't you talk about them?

Hondas and other japanese cars will last a life time. And so will BMW's, and other german cars. Its the domestics that die in 2 years.

The thing is though, all those cars may do 130 for example, but, the only one that can do 130 often, and for long spurts, would the germans. Japan, and Domestics can't do that. They don't have the good engineering that allows that like the germans.

I personally hate civics, mainly because most of the kids around me own them because they see articles in super street and import tuner about them. And they think by putting an air intake on it, its the fastest thing ever. So thats mainly why, civics are the creation of a fast and furious trend. Not all people are like that, but a lot.

But just cuz i hate them, doesn't mean that they can't put out some serious power. ALLLLLL engines, from the geo 3 cyl. to the jaguar v12, can put out serious hp and torque. Its all about tuning. If its tuned right, its gonna put out the power. all you need is the $$.

I think here we should all quit throwing stones, and talking ourselves up, cuz there is always gonna be someone faster.

 

[gusgar]

@318intelligance

Best thread I saw since last ice age. You are right, and there is something more to be said, the fastest car isn't the best one. A good car is many things far from a single powerful engine. That's the reason for all this BMW forums. It isn't easy to describe the "feeling" about to drive a good car, here in Medellin there are many cars fastest than my 328i, but you never "feel" the same drving a subaru, honda, or even a top end lexus that when you drive a Mercedes, Audi, Porshe or an old BMW.

For me quarter mile times are nothin, its only a way to measure pocket depht. There are things as trivial as the engine sound, BMW's engines deserve to be recorded to be listened when you are away from your car.

Have you ever saw a BMW or serious car plenty of blue, red flashing lights, of course no! here are many, as in the US, fast and furious cars, but when you have a clean BMW allways people turns their heads when you pass or even hear your exhaust melody.

The attached image lets you understan by a better way why the car's engine isn't the most important part of your happiness.

I continue loving all of you, MUA!!

 

[mikev]

ALLLLLL engines, from the geo 3 cyl. to the jaguar v12, can put out serious hp and torque. Its all about tuning. If its tuned right, its gonna put out the power. all you need is the $$.

not strictly true. when you see a clvic with 300hp then most of the engine would have been replaced and strengthened so its not really the same any more.

 

[318intelligance]

it still has 4 cylinders doesn't it? yes. So it is still a 4 cyl putting out insane amounts of power.


And by tuning, i mean adding new cams, modifying the head and block, good bolt ons, etc.

 

[ra328i]

i haven't been really active on this board, but i've got to say a couple things... honda's are probably the most innovative co. known to man. (asimo, turbos in formula 1 in the 80's) my brother has now owned 3 hondas. 1st car was a 97 prelude that i greatly enjoyed getting pulled over for 2 times for just to hear the vtec kick in, 2nd and current car a 99 civic si, and finally his crx ls/vtec beater that he got rid of due to the huge amount of maintenance that was needed to maintain it.
but as i thought about it, i asked him what he loved about hondas. his answer was, "their way more cost efficient and easy to make faster." isn't this what everyone wants? well..... not me. here's what i love about my bm, my power leather seats, silky smooth i-6, timeless design, sunroof, orange illumination, wood grain, and finally the fact that whenever i go to a picnic, people always look at me and go, "damn.... he must be doing pretty good!!!" i'm 22 (23 on the 29th!!!), don't know everything about driving skills, or cars, but i do know one gotdamn thing, i'd never give up my bmw for anything!!!!

 

[318intelligance]

spoken like a true bmw enthusiast.

 

[///M SPEED]

i haven't been really active on this board, but i've got to say a couple things... honda's are probably the most innovative co. known to man. (asimo, turbos in formula 1 in the 80's) my brother has now owned 3 hondas. 1st car was a 97 prelude that i greatly enjoyed getting pulled over for 2 times for just to hear the vtec kick in, 2nd and current car a 99 civic si, and finally his crx ls/vtec beater that he got rid of due to the huge amount of maintenance that was needed to maintain it.
but as i thought about it, i asked him what he loved about hondas. his answer was, "their way more cost efficient and easy to make faster." isn't this what everyone wants? well..... not me. here's what i love about my bm, my power leather seats, silky smooth i-6, timeless design, sunroof, orange illumination, wood grain, and finally the fact that whenever i go to a picnic, people always look at me and go, "damn.... he must be doing pretty good!!!" i'm 22 (23 on the 29th!!!), don't know everything about driving skills, or cars, but i do know one gotdamn thing, i'd never give up my bmw for anything!!!!